The reality Democrats have to to come to terms with is that the Courts aren't going to bail them out of confronting the near certainty of Trump as the GOP nominee. And what that means is a refusal to vote for Biden makes a Trump re-election more of a reality. So time to
- stop with the narrative about Biden being too old while ignoring that Trump is only a few years younger, and is ACTUALLY showing far more signs of being mentally unhinged, if not deranged, than anything Biden is doing.
-stop pretending as if Biden's initial stance on Israel was anything different than standard US government policy, by both parties, literally since Israel's creation or that Trump becoming President (as the only outcome to Biden not winning) will in any not be immeasurably worse for Gaza.
-stop pretending that Biden hasn't in fact been pushing for a ceasefire but ultimately has a limited degree of influence over a sovereign nation that is led by a hard right winger and supported by a cabinet that is every bit as genocidal against Muslims as Hamas is against Israel and that at this point the argument is not that he's refusing to criticize Israel, it's that he's not criticizing it ENOUGH for the liking of some.
-stop fantasizing that there is this new heretofore unknown "perfect" Democratic candidate out there, waiting to be called on who can immediately jump into the primaries to knock off an incumbent President (something that has never happened in US history) without doing immeasurable damage to the party's prospects in November.
-stop pretending that it "wont be that bad" if Trump wins, as a justification for all the above - Trump is telling us in real time what he will do. Think about the damage he did when he had people around him who were inclined to check him and didn't know which levers to use. He now has a Supreme Court that will do his bidding, complete control over the entire GOP caucus in Congress (does anyone doubt Mitch gets replaced by a true MAGA in the Senate?) which if he wins, will probably mean a majority in both Houses too, AND a far better understanding of the machinery of government and a willingness to ensure that it is staffed with MAGA true believers all the way through. He will absolutely wreak havoc in a second term - and not just in America, but worldwide (Canadian here - we're nervous as hell) all while being cheered on by half the country at least (and many more acolytes around the world, including up here).
In other words, its time for Democrats to grow the f**k up and realize the country is facing an existential crisis in November and act accordingly - stop with the petty bullshit. While I support all of the impending Court actions against Trump, I do so with the full understanding that none of them will mean shit unless Biden wins in November. If you 're afraid to take this to the polls, then we're already doomed.
Yep. We need to get out the f’king vote, make calls, write postcards, donate money, talk to your neighbors whatever it takes. Trump only cares about himself but he perfectly willing to push and implement an agenda that takes abortion rights away from every state, outlaws ivf and criminalizes doctor’s saving a women’s life from an ectopic pregnancy, overturning gay marriage, massive deportation of non white people and anything else that makes his deplorable base happy. Oh and he’s not going to solve the mess in the Middle East that has been going on for decades. At least he cares, trump will help destroy Gaza and not give it a second thought. And my god the age thing makes me crazy. Two old men running for office, one in good shape who rides his bike on the weekends and talks coherently about policy and what the country needs, the other one a bloated barely mobile spray tanned mess who spouts racist confused gibberish at his cult gatherings. I’m not going to leave if trump wins, but I’d like to Calexit away from this mess of a country.
I honestly don't know anyone who is convincing themselves that "Trump won't be that bad" if he gets elected again. Anyone arguing that is absolutely ignoring the warning signs and has let their personal biases obfuscate reality.
People must be, otherwise the other issues I listed wouldn't be the singular fixations of so many nominally Dem voters. tTe only way these issue are significant enough to impact your vote, as an erstwhile progressive or Democratic voter, is by having convinced yourself that the outcome to Biden not winning, i.e. a 2nd Trump Presidency, won't be that bad.....it requires a willful blindness to that.
>>Joe Biden, an incumbent who has become the scrappy underdog in this 2024 election according to meaningless polls, will have to win the old-fashioned way: By eliciting the most votes.<<
You mean THE MOST VOTES IN THE RIGHT STATES, because the Electoral College is affirmative action for the party that has seen its candidate win the popular vote only once since 2000 but has somehow been deemed the winner of three of the last six presidential elections....
Begrudgingly, I concede that this was the correct ruling. It would have ben absolute chaos, otherwise.
That said, it's an important reminder that the guardrails have been significantly tested and weakened during this entire, bruising process. It would be unwise to trust our institutions to do all the heavy lifting.
Again, as always, showing up and voting is the most important thing you can do.
I don't know. I loathe him (Trump) so much that any court ruling that would go against him gets a knee-jerk reaction from me of 'good'. HOWever, given that he hasn't been actually convicted of anything yet, insurrection-related, it would have been very very weird for SCOTUS to rule any other way than how they did. Nothing/no one is going to save us from Trump except a decisive election. The election this year is going to be very very ugly, no matter who wins. I'm legitimately afraid of either outcome. I don't think this country is going to survive what's heading our way. Maybe not overnight, but I feel like we've turned a corner and there's no coming back. It's not fair that the court keeps kicking the can down the road, it's not fair that Trump gets to keep gumming up the works, it's not fair that a decent man like Biden gets compared to the nightmare that Trump is like they're at all on the same level. None of this is fair.
The consensus of the not-insane or corrupt is that Section 3 is self-executing. In context to the Amendment, at the time, it was a matter of inarguable public record who was a seditious insurrectionist. Jefferson Davis or Robert Lee were, but so was any CSA Corporal or Private. It was dead simple.
It's public record that schmucks like Enrique Tarrio, Stewart Rhodes, and that idjit shaman Jake Angeli all did the thing too. Took criminal trials, but it's permanently there in the record. If any of those 1000-some convicted idiots ever petition for an office, they should get bounced by the local auditors.
If only Donnie from Queens would have gotten off his fat ass, hauled it to the Capitol & gotten selfies with the crowd . . but that's always been Donnie's MO. Never actually shooting a guy on 5th, but getting someone else to do it.
The Court majority really overstepped with this nonsense about Congressional statute, but they're showing their hand there - the bastards know that this Congress is never going to pass that bill, and Joe Biden won't sign it UNTIL Donnie finally is convicted of something related to January 6th.
It's wild to see people discovering , as if it's a new phenomenon, that SCOTUS has the power to make shit up as it goes and is just another vehicle for achieving political aims . The court has never been a neutral arbiter.
I'd take it a step further and say its wild to see people discovering that our entire system of Democracy, including the vaunted "checks and balances" at its heart is dependent entirely on the good faith actions of those in charge of administering and are far from "inherent" or "inalienable" no matter how many times its described as such.
the moment you have a case where or one of those levers stop acting in good faith, its surprisingly easy to tear the whole thing down. And unfortunately, that's where we are today.
Living thru the f’cking nightmare of 2000 and a conservative court shutting down the vote count in Florida and giving the presidency to the inarticulate nepo boy king (remember when we thought W was the worst president the republicans would ever dig up?) makes me have very little faith in this even more crazy right wing court. I will now complain about every idiot and every pundit who said there’s really no difference between trump and Clinton and gave us this nightmare court. And yeah, let’s do it all over again over a terrible conflict in the Middle East that has been going on for decades and is almost at this point unsolvable. Women’s right to chose, dying from a ectopic pregnancy, overturning gay marriage, national abortion ban, gun control, moving forward on climate change pffft who cares…ugh this country.
So, it's going to take them longer to determine if the president has total immunity than this case? It would seem that the immunity case is a slam dunk. Well, except for Clarence Thomas who will write his judgement on hundos provided by Harlan Crow.
I get the ruling. Do I think this jackhole should be on the ballot at all? Of course not. What I want to know is what the mechanism is for getting him off the ballot on the Federal level then? Because if it's not Congress keeping him off, WTF is it then, you useless, misbegotten RWNJ justices? What is it?!!!
Citizens are the ones bringing these suits to get him off the ballot, the majority of the people in these states want him off the ballot, the suits reflect the will of the constituencies imo.
Bullshit. There was an application made to the court - its impossible to say it represented the "majority of the people" since I doubt that was true of GOP supporters (a fact that will likely be confirmed when Colorado's primary is held) and the Court rendered a decision which was overturned at the Supreme Court - by a unanimous decision I might add. Not sure if you appreciate the significance of a unanimous ruling by THIS court. Anyway, that is how its supposed to work, and the "will of the majority" isn't always relevant to a constitutional analysis. You can quibble with the court's reasoning, but suggesting it overturned the will of the people in this case is nonsense - its not uncommon for appeal courts to overturn lower courts. I'd add that many of the most important rights enshrined by the Supreme Court over the years (and which may be in danger by this Court) were hardly representative of the "majority view" at time they were decided, so be mindful about getting overly fixated on that point when dealing with constitutional interpretation issues.
Disagree - it was a Court in Colorado that made a ruling on an application which was appealed, which is exactly what the Court is there for. Its not like it a ballot measure to take him off it.
While I'm not claiming barring Trump from the ballot in one state is the right call, we've long had different presidential candidates on ballots on a state-by-state basis without the republic rending in pieces.
I agree that I'm worried about the precedent one state court removing a major party candidate would set, but what the Supreme Court did today went much, much further than that, effectively amending the Constitution to require a law passed by Congress, and done so in a very specific manner or the court could strike it down, in order to enforce an already dully-passed amendment that by definition does not require any such further legislation.
Heck section 3 actually very clearly states a 2/3 Congressional vote can undo a candidate's disqualification—meaning the amendment's authors damn sure never intended a congressional act to IMPLEMENT it. Originalists my ass.
They conservative majority have effectively altogether eliminated the 14th amendment's provision disqualifying insurrectionists from office, and they did it all at a record pace (case filed on December 19) designed to help one, and only one, political party with a specific candidate that gave three of them their lifetime jobs, while at the same time also accepting, and then delaying, another case involving the same candidate's actual coup-ing. Both are transparent efforts to prop up the electoral viability of the man who appointed them.
If you think the person who "elicits" the most votes wins the U.S. presidential election. Ho boy, do I have news for you about two of our last four Presidents.
The reality Democrats have to to come to terms with is that the Courts aren't going to bail them out of confronting the near certainty of Trump as the GOP nominee. And what that means is a refusal to vote for Biden makes a Trump re-election more of a reality. So time to
- stop with the narrative about Biden being too old while ignoring that Trump is only a few years younger, and is ACTUALLY showing far more signs of being mentally unhinged, if not deranged, than anything Biden is doing.
-stop pretending as if Biden's initial stance on Israel was anything different than standard US government policy, by both parties, literally since Israel's creation or that Trump becoming President (as the only outcome to Biden not winning) will in any not be immeasurably worse for Gaza.
-stop pretending that Biden hasn't in fact been pushing for a ceasefire but ultimately has a limited degree of influence over a sovereign nation that is led by a hard right winger and supported by a cabinet that is every bit as genocidal against Muslims as Hamas is against Israel and that at this point the argument is not that he's refusing to criticize Israel, it's that he's not criticizing it ENOUGH for the liking of some.
-stop fantasizing that there is this new heretofore unknown "perfect" Democratic candidate out there, waiting to be called on who can immediately jump into the primaries to knock off an incumbent President (something that has never happened in US history) without doing immeasurable damage to the party's prospects in November.
-stop pretending that it "wont be that bad" if Trump wins, as a justification for all the above - Trump is telling us in real time what he will do. Think about the damage he did when he had people around him who were inclined to check him and didn't know which levers to use. He now has a Supreme Court that will do his bidding, complete control over the entire GOP caucus in Congress (does anyone doubt Mitch gets replaced by a true MAGA in the Senate?) which if he wins, will probably mean a majority in both Houses too, AND a far better understanding of the machinery of government and a willingness to ensure that it is staffed with MAGA true believers all the way through. He will absolutely wreak havoc in a second term - and not just in America, but worldwide (Canadian here - we're nervous as hell) all while being cheered on by half the country at least (and many more acolytes around the world, including up here).
In other words, its time for Democrats to grow the f**k up and realize the country is facing an existential crisis in November and act accordingly - stop with the petty bullshit. While I support all of the impending Court actions against Trump, I do so with the full understanding that none of them will mean shit unless Biden wins in November. If you 're afraid to take this to the polls, then we're already doomed.
I'm glad you typed that all out so I don't have to.
This is the right answer.
Yep. We need to get out the f’king vote, make calls, write postcards, donate money, talk to your neighbors whatever it takes. Trump only cares about himself but he perfectly willing to push and implement an agenda that takes abortion rights away from every state, outlaws ivf and criminalizes doctor’s saving a women’s life from an ectopic pregnancy, overturning gay marriage, massive deportation of non white people and anything else that makes his deplorable base happy. Oh and he’s not going to solve the mess in the Middle East that has been going on for decades. At least he cares, trump will help destroy Gaza and not give it a second thought. And my god the age thing makes me crazy. Two old men running for office, one in good shape who rides his bike on the weekends and talks coherently about policy and what the country needs, the other one a bloated barely mobile spray tanned mess who spouts racist confused gibberish at his cult gatherings. I’m not going to leave if trump wins, but I’d like to Calexit away from this mess of a country.
I honestly don't know anyone who is convincing themselves that "Trump won't be that bad" if he gets elected again. Anyone arguing that is absolutely ignoring the warning signs and has let their personal biases obfuscate reality.
People must be, otherwise the other issues I listed wouldn't be the singular fixations of so many nominally Dem voters. tTe only way these issue are significant enough to impact your vote, as an erstwhile progressive or Democratic voter, is by having convinced yourself that the outcome to Biden not winning, i.e. a 2nd Trump Presidency, won't be that bad.....it requires a willful blindness to that.
>>Joe Biden, an incumbent who has become the scrappy underdog in this 2024 election according to meaningless polls, will have to win the old-fashioned way: By eliciting the most votes.<<
You mean THE MOST VOTES IN THE RIGHT STATES, because the Electoral College is affirmative action for the party that has seen its candidate win the popular vote only once since 2000 but has somehow been deemed the winner of three of the last six presidential elections....
Begrudgingly, I concede that this was the correct ruling. It would have ben absolute chaos, otherwise.
That said, it's an important reminder that the guardrails have been significantly tested and weakened during this entire, bruising process. It would be unwise to trust our institutions to do all the heavy lifting.
Again, as always, showing up and voting is the most important thing you can do.
Agree. Did anyone really truly believe it would be any answer other than this?
I don't know. I loathe him (Trump) so much that any court ruling that would go against him gets a knee-jerk reaction from me of 'good'. HOWever, given that he hasn't been actually convicted of anything yet, insurrection-related, it would have been very very weird for SCOTUS to rule any other way than how they did. Nothing/no one is going to save us from Trump except a decisive election. The election this year is going to be very very ugly, no matter who wins. I'm legitimately afraid of either outcome. I don't think this country is going to survive what's heading our way. Maybe not overnight, but I feel like we've turned a corner and there's no coming back. It's not fair that the court keeps kicking the can down the road, it's not fair that Trump gets to keep gumming up the works, it's not fair that a decent man like Biden gets compared to the nightmare that Trump is like they're at all on the same level. None of this is fair.
The consensus of the not-insane or corrupt is that Section 3 is self-executing. In context to the Amendment, at the time, it was a matter of inarguable public record who was a seditious insurrectionist. Jefferson Davis or Robert Lee were, but so was any CSA Corporal or Private. It was dead simple.
It's public record that schmucks like Enrique Tarrio, Stewart Rhodes, and that idjit shaman Jake Angeli all did the thing too. Took criminal trials, but it's permanently there in the record. If any of those 1000-some convicted idiots ever petition for an office, they should get bounced by the local auditors.
If only Donnie from Queens would have gotten off his fat ass, hauled it to the Capitol & gotten selfies with the crowd . . but that's always been Donnie's MO. Never actually shooting a guy on 5th, but getting someone else to do it.
The Court majority really overstepped with this nonsense about Congressional statute, but they're showing their hand there - the bastards know that this Congress is never going to pass that bill, and Joe Biden won't sign it UNTIL Donnie finally is convicted of something related to January 6th.
It's wild to see people discovering , as if it's a new phenomenon, that SCOTUS has the power to make shit up as it goes and is just another vehicle for achieving political aims . The court has never been a neutral arbiter.
I'd take it a step further and say its wild to see people discovering that our entire system of Democracy, including the vaunted "checks and balances" at its heart is dependent entirely on the good faith actions of those in charge of administering and are far from "inherent" or "inalienable" no matter how many times its described as such.
the moment you have a case where or one of those levers stop acting in good faith, its surprisingly easy to tear the whole thing down. And unfortunately, that's where we are today.
More galling that the court would deliberately blow up their carefully crafted image of neutrality and then complain when people call them partisan.
Living thru the f’cking nightmare of 2000 and a conservative court shutting down the vote count in Florida and giving the presidency to the inarticulate nepo boy king (remember when we thought W was the worst president the republicans would ever dig up?) makes me have very little faith in this even more crazy right wing court. I will now complain about every idiot and every pundit who said there’s really no difference between trump and Clinton and gave us this nightmare court. And yeah, let’s do it all over again over a terrible conflict in the Middle East that has been going on for decades and is almost at this point unsolvable. Women’s right to chose, dying from a ectopic pregnancy, overturning gay marriage, national abortion ban, gun control, moving forward on climate change pffft who cares…ugh this country.
So, it's going to take them longer to determine if the president has total immunity than this case? It would seem that the immunity case is a slam dunk. Well, except for Clarence Thomas who will write his judgement on hundos provided by Harlan Crow.
I get the ruling. Do I think this jackhole should be on the ballot at all? Of course not. What I want to know is what the mechanism is for getting him off the ballot on the Federal level then? Because if it's not Congress keeping him off, WTF is it then, you useless, misbegotten RWNJ justices? What is it?!!!
Oh hey it's the Supreme Court overruling the decisions of the people. Again. What a shock.
What?! This wasn't a "decision of the people". It was a court decision. This is the Supreme Court 100% doing their jobs.
Citizens are the ones bringing these suits to get him off the ballot, the majority of the people in these states want him off the ballot, the suits reflect the will of the constituencies imo.
Bullshit. There was an application made to the court - its impossible to say it represented the "majority of the people" since I doubt that was true of GOP supporters (a fact that will likely be confirmed when Colorado's primary is held) and the Court rendered a decision which was overturned at the Supreme Court - by a unanimous decision I might add. Not sure if you appreciate the significance of a unanimous ruling by THIS court. Anyway, that is how its supposed to work, and the "will of the majority" isn't always relevant to a constitutional analysis. You can quibble with the court's reasoning, but suggesting it overturned the will of the people in this case is nonsense - its not uncommon for appeal courts to overturn lower courts. I'd add that many of the most important rights enshrined by the Supreme Court over the years (and which may be in danger by this Court) were hardly representative of the "majority view" at time they were decided, so be mindful about getting overly fixated on that point when dealing with constitutional interpretation issues.
Disagree - it was a Court in Colorado that made a ruling on an application which was appealed, which is exactly what the Court is there for. Its not like it a ballot measure to take him off it.
originalism is when you tell the 14th amendment to go fuck itself
Anna Lind-Guzik @alindguzik.bsky.social
Disagree. Wrong ruling. And they know it. It’s just BS.
While I'm not claiming barring Trump from the ballot in one state is the right call, we've long had different presidential candidates on ballots on a state-by-state basis without the republic rending in pieces.
I agree that I'm worried about the precedent one state court removing a major party candidate would set, but what the Supreme Court did today went much, much further than that, effectively amending the Constitution to require a law passed by Congress, and done so in a very specific manner or the court could strike it down, in order to enforce an already dully-passed amendment that by definition does not require any such further legislation.
Heck section 3 actually very clearly states a 2/3 Congressional vote can undo a candidate's disqualification—meaning the amendment's authors damn sure never intended a congressional act to IMPLEMENT it. Originalists my ass.
They conservative majority have effectively altogether eliminated the 14th amendment's provision disqualifying insurrectionists from office, and they did it all at a record pace (case filed on December 19) designed to help one, and only one, political party with a specific candidate that gave three of them their lifetime jobs, while at the same time also accepting, and then delaying, another case involving the same candidate's actual coup-ing. Both are transparent efforts to prop up the electoral viability of the man who appointed them.
If you think the person who "elicits" the most votes wins the U.S. presidential election. Ho boy, do I have news for you about two of our last four Presidents.
https://www.threads.net/@judgeluttig/post/C4HSLy_sJH1/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==